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Voir la version complète : I am unhappy AGAIN DAZ !!



Corndog
08/06/2006, 02h29
I have posted this over at the DAZ forum because of content concerns.
Am I that wrong? I have received a few emails and messages from friends who feel the same way. I thought this was wrong when I saw the newsletter and thought I was over reacting and then I hear others too were offended..


I have opened my email today to find a newsletter from DAZ with an offer of Mullberry or something like that..
this character looks like she is 14 and dressed inappropriately. Then I read this, "Come meet Mulberry – a fresh beauty for Aiko 3. She can be sweet, she can be dark, she can be anything you want!"
Sounds sexual and appears sexual and the model looks very under age. Please remove such models and descriptions.
This is offensive.

What do you think.. Don't bash just your opinion pls

LoneGunman
08/06/2006, 02h55
As European, I have more loose stand when it comes to these matters (my morality was never influenced by the dark ages :p).

I personnaly do not care too much, unless is very explicit. She looks well dressed to me (no nudity at all), and about 16, but that's what I see :)

Everybody these days is using provocative statements when it comes to advertising, from CK to DAZ.

It did not get my attention, but I bet it works, otherwise, they would not do it...:hi:

bwtr
08/06/2006, 02h56
On the webs are M, MA, X and XX stuff. No way will it ever be "cleaned" up to the level some may want. It's like TV programmes, you switch to a programme you are comfortable with viewing. You can not expect to change what are normal variations in taste--I dont like either end of the right or left extremes.

manleystanley
08/06/2006, 03h04
I wont say your wrong, but I can't say I agree with you.

Corndog
08/06/2006, 03h47
Ty guys great points..
I have opted to change the channel.. Removing email newsletters and my account there.. Its just not for me..

Tirade
08/06/2006, 06h15
I feel you, Corndog.

That particular image didn't exactly burn my eyes to look at...but I know where your coming from.

Good for you for saying something.:)

~Liam~

bwtr
08/06/2006, 07h10
Good for you Corndog. I keep access to Daz because of the much good free stuff- but the Galleries leave me cold as cold. I am/was a photographer and many years as an artist drawing the nude at art classes-it's damn hard work- you don't realy see the model as a nude--but those Daz galleries are, from an art point of view, pretty juvenile. (Great craft--not Art!)

vagula2002
08/06/2006, 08h36
I'm from Europe (Amsterdam) so I don't think it's a big deal. I have a bigger problem that nobody cares that a lot of those girls holding weapons.

Also in the game industry you can't show a nipple but you can blow everybody's head off. Youngsters these day think that sex is bad, but killing is normal. That's a wrong moral I personally think.

LoneGunman
08/06/2006, 08h51
I'm from Europe (Amsterdam) so I don't think it's a big deal. I have a bigger problem that nobody care's that a lot of those girls holding wapons.

Also in the game industry you can't show a nipple but you can blow everybodys head off. Yungsters these day think that sex is bad, but killing is normal. That's a wrong moral I think peronaly.


Could not agree more (not that is a "bigger problem", more like irony) :hi:

bwtr
08/06/2006, 09h02
Vagula makes the point! I am most furious about all those mothers, grandmothers, people with pushers, who cross AGAINST the pedestrian lights at the crossings!

When they visit thier children in the morgue will they appreciate that their example "instructed" those children (grandchildren) to ignore the road rules?

bwtr
08/06/2006, 09h30
As a PS, I joined the DAz "Art Zone" site. Where would you place THAT on a graph of 'IQ/Intelegence"???

Corndog
08/06/2006, 13h16
Good points guys... Vagul I agree about the weapons etc for sure
Nudity I have no problem with.. Nudity or provocative poses/ descriptions on a very young looking character I do have a problem..

Once again great discussion.

Sarissi
08/06/2006, 13h25
Aiko and Hiro are Anime figures, which look younger than they are. Just look at the art form from Japan.

manleystanley
08/06/2006, 13h58
I've been saying for years that the media in the US seams to have the opinion that "exploding blouses are bad, exploding heads are ok." and then we try to blaim video games for teen violence. They've grown up with the view that violence is a proper problem solving tool.

geqfreq
08/06/2006, 14h22
I gues you could blame the way the artist rendered her to make her more apealing.... but if he got a reaction at all then his job was well done.

Corndog
08/06/2006, 14h26
Lets get back to what this is about.....

This model looks 12 - 15 in my eyes and every woman here at work all 50 of them agree.. This model is too young to be dressed and posed like that and sold by a company that I was associated with.

Forget all the weapons/ sex sells stuff... I am talking about a graphic of a young lady posed/advertised/described and dressed innapropriately..

As far as Japan goes.. and the anime I live in Canada

Corndog
08/06/2006, 15h00
So are you saying its ok to have children/very young looking character dressed like that and posed like that to get attention and sell products ??

HeavyHanded
08/06/2006, 15h15
CornDoggyDogg, your words made me reflect deeply on my own views. I think living in Japan is slowly desensitizing me to such things.

[BTW for all of you who think that these young anime girls don't have an effect on the Japanese male psyche, it really does, and is becoming a problem here]

I hope that your comments don't fall on deaf ears...


But on a totally 'artistic' view. I think that Mulberry is really well done!:blush2:
:shiny:

manleystanley
08/06/2006, 15h36
"So are you saying its ok to have children/very young looking character dressed like that and posed like that to get attention and sell products" No, I'm saying that it is my opinion that you are misstaken in your assumption of the age of the figure involved. Take that figure and put it behind the wheel of a car, now she's 16, have her standing at the alter in a wedding gown, now she's 18, the figure hasn't changed just your perseption of it.
As I stated else were, you're seeing something that isn't there. I have often wondered about people that see things this way. It dosen't turn me on so I don't see it as erotic, and I certainly don't see the charactor as 14, but apparently you do. So whom has the problem?

geqfreq
08/06/2006, 15h55
Obviously you are not the target audience for this campaign. At the very least, if it's intruding in your life you could always take yourself off the mailing list.

Ringo Monfort
08/06/2006, 16h24
There is going to be two different newsletters in the future one directed to software and the other for content users. DAZ is also working on changing the website to a more professional look that shows off the software. The changes won't happen overnight but they are in the works.

Regarding your comments and concern others in the yahoo groups have express similar opinions regarding the newsletter and that is why they are going to make changes and have 2 different ones.

Bob Stockwell VP of marking stated this:



Before this spins too far and people start getting offended, let me jump in
here.

We are undertaking a huge effort to change our website and more. We
identified long before any of these threads started that we would need to
take a clean look at what this company would be now that it is involved
heavily in both content and software. These changes will not happen
overnight or in the 5 weeks that we have been together. There is much to
do, but it takes a planned approach to make it work right. We have a plan,
we are beginning to execute that plan, and it will bear out in the
appropriate time.
.....................

Thank you.
Bob
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bob Stockwell
Vice President, Sales and Marketing
DAZ Productions, Inc.

geqfreq
08/06/2006, 16h36
Bravo... :thomas: Daz is taking charge...

dlk30341
08/06/2006, 17h51
http://forum.daz3d.com/viewtopic.php?t=38781&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=54

Page 4, scroll down & read what Sarsa the creator of said item had to say abouth this. Apprently her promo renders where changed un-announced to her. Not that it helps out, but might help to further explain :)

-ash-
08/06/2006, 18h46
There is going to be two different newsletters in the future one directed to software and the other for content users. DAZ is also working on changing the website to a more professional look that shows off the software. The changes won't happen overnight but they are in the works.


This is good news, but I can't help thinking it would have been so much better to have quietly updated the old Eovia site with 'a DAZ company' logos then slowly moved everything over to the new one. Would have saved an awful lot of ill feeling and perhaps bad publicity. Maybe DAZ didn't have the rights to www.eovia.com so couldn't use it.

Ah well, it's all done now so let's just move forward and hope the new site gets the software away from situations like this one.

steama
08/06/2006, 19h23
DAZ obviously has succeeded very well with the presentation of this ad. This is one example of many that underscores why DAZ had the money to purchase Hexagon and Carrara. Many people pay for this stuff. I am impressed that DAZ knows how to generate income. I hope they continue to be successful but would not mind them separating the content messages from the software messages.

It is also obvious that these type of promotions offend many and this is not positive for DAZ. Some adjustment is definately required.

I showed the ad to my wife and she was offended by the presentation and the content. As for me I thought it was no big deal at all. In fact I was impressed once again by DAZ's marketing savy.

Hopefully DAZ will make adjustments to more satisfy different and separate aspects of their business portfolio. If they are as smart about it as they seem to be they will do something different to keep all their customers happy.

manleystanley
08/06/2006, 19h45
Daz should thank corndog for the advertising, as his thread spurd quite a few sales. People checked it out just to see what the hubub was about.
"It is also obvious that these type of promotions offend many" those many are awful quiet about it. "keep all their customers happy." oh that's not possable and you know it lol

Quite awhile back, when I first got on line, I downloaded a lot of free stuff. Most of the sites I went to wanted you to regester before you could download. One site; which seems to be banned from most forums, wasn't my taist at all. The first e-mail I got from this site put my jaw on the computer desk. O_O I immediately canceled any further e-mails. problem solved.
And I'm all for this "There is going to be two different newsletters in the future one directed to software and the other for content users."

Corndog
08/06/2006, 20h31
"So are you saying its ok to have children/very young looking character dressed like that and posed like that to get attention and sell products" No, I'm saying that it is my opinion that you are misstaken in your assumption of the age of the figure involved. Take that figure and put it behind the wheel of a car, now she's 16, have her standing at the alter in a wedding gown, now she's 18, the figure hasn't changed just your perseption of it.
As I stated else were, you're seeing something that isn't there. I have often wondered about people that see things this way. It dosen't turn me on so I don't see it as erotic, and I certainly don't see the charactor as 14, but apparently you do. So whom has the problem?

Manely I just read that post and the quote I made did not sound like it was intended when I typed it.. And yes if you put that model behind the wheel of a car she is now 16 I AGREE.. But do a little test take just the face shot on the ad and put it in front of 20 women and ask how old they think she is, then read the quote under her.. I had 18 of 20 women say she looks 11 - 15 and they did not like the ad.

manleystanley
08/06/2006, 20h46
But how many of those women were familiar with anima? It also has alot to do with the area. If I showed some of the women around here pictures of V3 in some fetish grab, they would recommend shuting the site down.
I'm not totally disagreeing with you, I think there is too much overt sexuallity in most of poserdom. A good example is the clothing, 1 set of jeans for David, 30+ negligés for V3. When I first came on line my first exposiur to Poser was frightening, it set my opinion of poser to this day. What I found was 3/4 of the poser sites were poser porn, including kiddy porn. :ermm: Thank got most of those sites have been closed down. :happy:

Corndog
08/06/2006, 21h30
There is going to be two different newsletters in the future one directed to software and the other for content users. DAZ is also working on changing the website to a more professional look that shows off the software. The changes won't happen overnight but they are in the works.

Regarding your comments and concern others in the yahoo groups have express similar opinions regarding the newsletter and that is why they are going to make changes and have 2 different ones. :

Ringo that's great news.

vagula2002
08/06/2006, 21h33
The following comments are in no way directed to you Corndog or to anyone else here in this forum, just to make that clear in advance. Please don't take offence.

I think that if someone gets sexually aroused by a 14-15 year old in a mini skirt or hot-pants there must be something wrong with his/her brain. All I see is a 14 year old who's dressed cute. For me this has no sexual connotation what so ever.

So why are some people offended by this? where is this coming from? Culture difference? Difference in upbringing? Is it because society says sex is wrong, so that people can't see the difference anymore? Mankind are sexual beings and I think it's bad to suppress those feelings and it give's you no sense about the really bad things in this world!

Don't misunderstand me, sex with children is really wrong, but personally I don't see anything in that picture to make the association with that.

So to wrap it up I didn't see it and I don't see it now, my mind does not work that way and I was brought up by my parents with the fact sex is a GOOD thing (for adults). So being raised in a family where openness en honesty was valued I grew into a healthy man with his BRAIN as largest sexual organ.

Hmm, makes you think doesn't it?

mon_stdnt
08/06/2006, 21h34
I agree with that the ad is a little provocative,especially the writing,:ermm: but that's how anime character's look. Even in some games the male looks like a female and his voice is a bit high, that doesn't mean were are going to get mad just because the male figure is protrait as a "girly-man":happy:

Anyway's lets just hope that Daz's new "make over" pleases are eyes.

Locki
09/06/2006, 00h04
:crying2: Just hoping so as well, because for the moment, the fears expressed on this forum on the 4/28 seem to become reality, unfortunately ... especially as regard as the downgrading process that might happen for C5 and H2 in professionnals' mind :(