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solt
29/06/2007, 03h37
this is my way to say farwell to every one ...

Imagine by John Lennon


Imagine there's no Heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one

I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say I'm
a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

mayito7777
29/06/2007, 14h16
Blaming the US for all the problems of the world is a very stupid comment, this forum is not about politics, it is about graphic design, just my 2 cents. I respect Thomas so I will not engage in any argument that can harm this website.

solt
29/06/2007, 15h14
Blaming the US for all the problems of the world is a very stupid comment, this forum is not about politics, it is about graphic design, just my 2 cents. I respect Thomas so I will not engage in any argument that can harm this website.

yes, mayito7777, it is about graphic design, that is why i make a drawing to tell my point of view...
and i am not Blaming the US as a country and people ...
but Blaming one man and his governement ...we all know him...
mayito7777, open your eyes, Seek and ye shall find the truth...
i think, jesus did not agree with what occurs on its native soil now ..

and I respect Thomas too...he give us a space for any kind and style of art , even the" political one" :):hi:

mayito7777
29/06/2007, 15h30
Like I said, I will not engage in politics, when man learns to look upon and depend upon the true God, only then war will cease and hate will cease, until then we will keep blamiung each other. Until we as men learn to assume responsibilities and act like humans no like animals we will better off as a race. Hitler, Stalin, Lenin, Castro, mao and many others have done million of things worse than the President of United States but I don't see you creating any art reflecting that point. Don't forget that many hundreds of thousands of americans gave their life to make France free.

solt
29/06/2007, 15h55
love you mayito7777, i love all hmankind on this earth.
but when i see , little childrens dying for economic purpose, my heart is bleeding...

we are not talking about politics, but about humanity ...
you know what, my next" political drawing" is about tibet...

tibet is not a part of CHINA, the Chinese government only wishes to make it chineese with brutal force and death sentances...etc...
something no one talk about...

peace and love brother :hi:

jbshorty
29/06/2007, 16h06
everyone here is entitled to express their opinion. In fact, most of the world would agree with Solt's point of view...

shorty

mayito7777
29/06/2007, 16h14
That is why I said I will not engage in political arguments. My opinion is my opinion.

Thomas
02/07/2007, 10h56
Humpf...
I'm open to all opinion here, including politics, but that's true that we have to focus on the creation itself. I'm ok about this kind of illustration, because since the beginning of creation and art, a lot of all these creations were related to religion, war and others. Interpretation is always welcome, if it doesn't become a provocation or a non respect of others.

Expand your mind, see further than your nose, open your mind and understand others opinion is very important :)

solt
02/07/2007, 22h29
see further than your nose, :)


lol mayito7777 have no nose , in his avatar i mean lol

it's just joke , mayito :hi:no hate in my heart about any one here in this forum :flower:

mayito7777
02/07/2007, 23h25
Ok I will grow a nose>:innocent:

Wася
03/07/2007, 09h41
We in Russia like to hate America too. But all the Europe also. And the rest of the world.
We are using computers with American processors and Swiss wrist watches, wearing Italian cloth, driving German cars, drinking French wine, eating Brazilian beaf and the bread made from Canadian weat, and we hate you all. Because all the evil comes from your side.
Gott mit uns:take_exam

The only question I have - how old are you, solt? Six, judging by this painting and view.

Davidoff
03/07/2007, 11h21
Le problème c'est le manque d'humour dans ton image. C'est à peu près du niveau des caricatures du prophète. Aucune chance de faire passer un message comme ça...

The problem it is the lack of humour in your image. It is the same thing that the prophet caricatures last year (no humour=agressivity). No chance to transmit a message like that...

Thomas
03/07/2007, 12h41
Davidoff : in english perhaps?

Davidoff
03/07/2007, 15h11
i dit it

solt
03/07/2007, 15h15
Wася >
I do not hate americans or any other poeple !!!
and i don't hate russian people about what their leaders do in tchechnia !

and i'am old enough to expresses my point of view...

---------------------------------------------------------

Davidoff >
my drawing expresses an instantaneous reaction about a particular and not humoristic or a funny reality.
sorry i don't beleive in humour facing those tragedies, wherever it occurs...
peace and love :flower:

ps. i don't think , the americans that fight against war in the USA , like Michael Moore and millions of american citizens , hate their country or people...

Davidoff
03/07/2007, 16h05
ok but i hope you will illustrate the islamic atrocities too. (parce s'il y a des gens qui coupent des têtes c'est bien eux non?)

jbshorty
03/07/2007, 16h30
...ps. i don't think , the americans that fight against war in the USA , like Michael Moore and millions of american citizens , hate their country or people...

that's correct. we still love our country, our people, and our soliders too. If we disagree with poilitics, we can only blame the politicans for their actions (and especially we can blame those other politicians "behind the curtain" which help put them into office lol )...

shorty

Wася
03/07/2007, 18h19
solt, your painting is a good illustration of you love, and your ability to express your thoughts and feelings.

By the way, our leaders do nothing in Chechnya. They just did all necessary preparations and made people fight each other. Russian citizens against Russian citizens. And all the rest was done by our people (from both sides), not leaders. It's a kind of civilian war, and cannot be explained by immature formulas like "good people, bad government".

solt
03/07/2007, 21h43
that's correct. we still love our country, our people, and our soliders too. If we disagree with poilitics, we can only blame the politicans for their actions (and especially we can blame those other politicians "behind the curtain" which help put them into office lol )...

shorty

I agree with your point of view, shorty :hi:



solt, your painting is a good illustration of you love, and your ability to express your thoughts and feelings.

By the way, our leaders do nothing in Chechnya. They just did all necessary preparations and made people fight each other. Russian citizens against Russian citizens. And all the rest was done by our people (from both sides), not leaders. It's a kind of civilian war, and cannot be explained by immature formulas like "good people, bad government".
thanks for your compliments :)

and i understand well what you said :hi:

solt
03/07/2007, 22h05
ok but i hope you will illustrate the islamic atrocities too. (parce s'il y a des gens qui coupent des têtes c'est bien eux non?)

une tête occidentale coupé fait la une des journaux.
100 irakiens tués dans une une explosion terroriste, soutenue par l'armée US , c'est une banalité !!!

obviously, you don't read my word from the begening.

fuck of all the killers of childrens and innocent people.
military, they are or religious terrorists - that don't have any relation with the real islam !!!
they both work hand in hand over there ...

Davidoff
03/07/2007, 22h33
obviously, you don't read my word from the begening.

Effectivement, une image réalisée avec talent n'a pas besoin d'une notice explicative. ce n'est manifestement pas le cas ici.

Hugo
03/07/2007, 22h35
ok, please stop this kind discussion/words, Geo Politics, Religion this are the best subjects to start new fights.
Thanks
http://lapin-networks.com/takethis.jpg

Wася
04/07/2007, 06h28
thanks for your compliments :)
And this illustrate your sence of humor. But Davidoff told about it already.

bwtr
04/07/2007, 06h48
It would be a better world if there were no religions and their conflicting beliefs and attitudes, based on the same books, were put into the fairytale category where they belong!

Politics and Religions have no place in international web sites

bwtr
04/07/2007, 07h14
http://www.venganza.org/

I am PROUD to be a Pastararian!

We need to have FUN in life!

Wася
04/07/2007, 07h18
"Politics and Religions have no place in international web sites"
I suggest to add this to Polyloop rules list.

Thomas, it's your call.

jbshorty
04/07/2007, 08h27
"Politics and Religions have no place in international web sites"
I suggest to add this to Polyloop rules list.

I think this whole thread has gone way out of control. everybody here needs to think for one minute about a few points:

1. Do you really think Solt created this with an ill-intention towards anybody? I don't. Check the history of his postings, he seems to be a nice person who cares about issues which are affecting people as a whole. I see NOTHING offensive in this work. Unless your name is George W. Bush.

2. Anybody who would refer to another member's work or opinion as "immature" "stupid" or similar should learn to have tolerance for another person's view which you disagree with.

3. Religion and Politics have no place in an "art" community forum? Are you people freaking serious?!

4. It's been mentioned that this forum is about the "creation" process. Obviously you guys feel very strongly about this. Please go back and review all the threads which have absolutely NOTHING to do with 2D/3D techniques, software, hardware, or the creation process. These do not qualify under your definition of a suitable Polyloop discussion topic. Please remove them immediately. I find them offensive :[

While we're on the issue of subject matter- the gallery banner is displaying one work of blood flying through the air, another has a decapitated head on a stick. Better get rid of those too :huh: ...

shorty

bwtr
04/07/2007, 08h59
Shorty. Re point 3. I can look at the strident newspaper cartoon of the day depicting an (hilarious) opposite vue of my beliefs. Or a painted art work, depicting a belief contrary to my views maybe, and enjoy it.

It's not that the imagery was commited to a "vue"--what imagery is not?--what I object to is that people can not appreciate the value of that artistry based on the concepts from which it was inspired.

Its like saying an art work can not be good if it is not beautifull!

What IS beauty/beautiful???

Does that idea/premise create interest to all?

Piem
04/07/2007, 09h11
Announcement
I have moved this topic to misc/ discussion/what you want for some visible reasons for now.
:happy:

Wася
04/07/2007, 10h19
1. Do you really think Solt created this with an ill-intention towards anybody? ...

I don't know, can not read his mind, specially by internet. I just can talk about the result of his good intention.


2. Anybody who would refer to another member's work or opinion as "immature" "stupid" or similar should learn to have tolerance for another person's view which you disagree with.

"Stupid"? You said that, not me. Why this word occured?
And if I would draw some of my opponents looking like pigs, will you take it as a proof of my tolerance and maturity? Or only if my opponent will be George Bush? Who else?

bwtr
04/07/2007, 10h34
Look, all you blokes know you are wrong.

If it's not your wife it's your children telling you so.

Davidoff
04/07/2007, 10h43
Don't forget: to criticize democracies (US - UK or France) is very easy and whitout danger. If you criticize some religion aspect you risc your life.

Couerl
04/07/2007, 11h42
Solt, you forgot the wings and the halo over the pigs head. :)

History will paint it's own picture and I doubt it will be like yours, but this is my opinion and I think balance always returns to us all in the end.

Politics are a very important part of art and all of our views have purpose and meaning and argument/debate is good for people and helps us find middle ground through different ideas and reason.

I like the detail of the face, it looks like you spent most of your time there and did a great job.
There's a lot of bad things going on in the world today and a lot of change as the Earth becomes a smaller place to live, resources diminish, communications increase (web) and more people coming together every day from different countries. Iraq is just one place where children die. Tibet, Nepal, Darfur (a very bad place), Indonesia, the list goes on... Despite all of this, the world itself is becoming stronger and closer as tyranny's, one by one fall and communism is replaced by opportunity and freedom.
Maybe you think it is a bad thing for the US to be in Iraq and you may or may not be right. We thought it was a bad thing to be in Vietnam too, but suddenly, all these years after the French left Vietnam and then the US, Vietnamese people are embracing a new form of economic growth, capitalism and they are abandoning their communist past. China is doing much the same and right now in fact, Vietnams economic growth is 6.8% GDP yearly, a number only seen in the free world. Maybe we were wrong to go there, (I don't think so myself) but we left a footprint that could not be erased, both French and American people live free and the rest of the world (the world that does not) sees this and wants this and should have it too. Russia is setting its own example that free enterprise works and opportunity gives people more hope than working for a state. Some day places like Cuba, Iran, Syria and North Korea will follow suit and it is our responsibilty as free men to help them. Whether you like or dislike George Bush makes no difference really, since he cannot remain longer than 8 years as a president... The Iraqi people had no such luxury as this and now perhaps they will. I think even if we left tomorrow and allowed the country to fall into a civil war that the footprint has already been made. A free world to me is worth the fight, even if some innocents die on the way. The conflict in Iraq is no more about Oil or economic profit than the Invason of Normandy was about wine and cheese, it's just not that simple and in fact the price of gas here just keeps going up.

jbshorty
04/07/2007, 15h52
@ Brian - Like Solt mentioned already, sometimes a serious topic can not be viewed with humor. If you make joke about the tragic circumstance of another, that is truly mean. But if you make political jokes (as most newspaper comics often do) that should be OK because it is only a criticism of that politician's action. Which of course is OK (and required!) that we criticize... Certainly it's not required for art to be "beautiful". I much prefer a horrific art which makes me think, than something pretty which makes me think of nothing...

@ Wacr - I didn't say it. But if you read through the whole thread, you will find it... Who do you consider to be your opponent? Public officials understand they will suffer these criticisms on a daily basis. So there really is no taboo. It's just part of their job. A symbol of their elitist inner circle...

@ Couerl - It is funny how the price of gas keeps going up, yet the oil companies are enjoying record profits. And friends of GWB run those companies. I suggest the big oil companies should finance this war. It's good thing in one respect though. Because rising gas prices are forcing people to demand alternative fuel sources. So i don't mind to see those prices go a bit higher. I just hope the obscenely large profits are invested into more research for "green" fuels...

shorty

thierry
05/07/2007, 02h24
First : A political idea can be translated as a picture. Only technical problem
Two : An Artist is a political body so his art shows what he is. But if he does politics or religion with his arts that's, in reality, a mission fact. Not art in final.
three : the job of an artist is not religion, politics but research similar as an scientist.

So on polyloop, I believe there are not great artists but we are agree with this third point... only. We try, all the members, to search something. With the religion or the political opinions we have find normaly something because we are adults now.

Caricature is not art because is just for un moment, the actuality. That's not a third point. Caricature is also a hard critic about others guys. So It's not a Polyloop approval... really. Polyloop is a big chance for us because, these is a place in peace, with a great liberty and every boody can talk... BUT we must be adult to preserve our "land". So i'm not agree with political or religion caricatures on polyloop. It's not a censure because everywhere we can see them.
So peace and 3D please :-)

Wася
05/07/2007, 06h49
bwtr, you right, but I really don't care about George Bush. I don't even care about toilet humor, 'cause I'm not too sensible kind.

Solt drew a pig. But! The picture actually symbolize that solt hates war and loves people in America, Chechnya, Burundi and Madagascar, loves Christ, Mohammed, Buddha, Jegovah and John Lennon. Trees and dophlins. And it is not a picture (list price $0.20) anymore. With all this trivial trend of developments it become THE act of creation!! Love and peace fighting!!!

Oh, please, lads. I will not bite at this bait. I'm living in a country which is B.S. exporter, not importer.

What I really care is a complete absence of imagination. That's deadly sin for an artist.

Pete Exxtreme
05/07/2007, 21h51
Way of life, Religions, Politics are not taboo subjects on polyloop. But the moderators try to avoid that a pleasant discussion becames a fight without end... . Polyloop is not keen with such a mindset. After a general agreement with the admins/modos, this thread is closed.

laughingnome
05/07/2007, 22h11
Way of live, Religions, Politics are not taboo subjects on polyloop. But the moderators try to avoid that a pleasant discussion becames a fight without end... . Polyloop is not keen with such a mindset. After a general agreement with the admins/modos, this thread is closed.


agreed, these threads are pointless as no one ever changes their viewpoint, which they are intitaled to and are their own.

stu